El 22 de noviembre de 1963, Frazier llevo a Oswald hasta el Book Depository de Texas. Le dijo a la Comisión Warren que Oswald llevó un paquete al trabajo ese día que, según él contenía barras de cortina. En su libro La Conspiración de Kennedy, el autor, Anthony Summers, señala: "Irónicamente", fue gracias Frazier y su hermana que se creó una ligera duda de que Oswald había en realidad, estado llevando el arma del crimen en lugar de sus" barras de la cortina ". Ambos insistieron en que el paquete de Oswald estaba unos ocho centímetros más bajo que el desensamblado Mannlicher-Carcano. Frazier demostrado esto al mostrar que Oswald no podía físicamente haber llevado un rifle de 35 pulgadas metida en la axila con la base ahuecada en su mano, como Frazier recordó. "Sólo Jack Dougherty vio a Oswald entrar en el Book Depository Texas, el 22 de noviembre de 1963. Sin embargo, le dijo a la Comisión Warren que Oswald no llevaba "nada en las manos" cuando llegó la mañana.
Bueno vamos a empezar a analizar el testimonio de Frazier, sabemos que trabajaba en el TSBD con Oswald, Frazier vivía en Irving, Texas y era vecino de Ruth Paine con quien residía Marina Oswald, no así Lee Harvey Oswald, como ya se menciono antes vivía con su hermana Linnie Mae Randle, su cuñado William Edward Randle y 3 hijas, en su testimonio asegura que su madre Essie Mae Williams, se encontraba quedándose en su casa ya que su padrastro estaba internado en el hospital y su madre se quedo ahí entre 4 o 5 semanas coincidiendo su estancia con el día del asesinato. Al igual que Oswald, Frazier llevaba poco tiempo trabajando en el TSBD, apenas había entrado en Septiembre de ese año que sucedió el asesinato mientras que Oswald entro en Octubre, el se encargaba de llenar los pedidos. Trabajaba 8 horas y 5 días a la semana, asegura que el conoció a Oswald un lunes por la mañana cuando fue su primer día de trabajo, pero en ese entonces solo lo conocía por el nombre de Lee con el que se presento, Frazier asegura que Oswald le hablaba de planes futuros como comprarse un auto o tomar clases de conducir, al igual que la mayoría de los empleados del TSBD Frazier diría que Oswald era muy reservado, pocas veces pudo hablar con el mientras iban en el trayecto hacia el trabajo, recuerda que una vez estuvieron hablando de bebes ya que parecía que a Oswald le gustaban mucho, pues tenia un hijo y Marina en ese momento se encontraba esperando otro, Oswald rió un momento pero después volvió a cortar la platica, aun así nunca le menciono nada de política comunismo, partidos políticos ni siquiera de la visita del presidente a Dallas (Recordemos también que hay un testimonio de un empleado del TSBD que asegura que Oswald le pregunto "Porque había mucha gente" dando a entender que no tenia idea de que el presidente iba a pasar por ahí) Frazier pocas veces almorzaba con Oswald, el día del asesinato del presidente no llevo almuerzo pero si llevaba una bolsa parecida a las que se llevan para el almuerzo aunque según Oswald llevaba cortineros. Un dia antes del asesinato, el jueves 21 de Noviembre, Frazier se encontraba haciendo pedidos sobre la mesa del primer piso, Oswald se acerco a el diciéndole si podía viajar con el esta tarde a lo que Frazier respondió que si, le dijo que el podía viajar con el en cualquier momento que quisiera ir a ver a su esposa, después Frazier le pregunto "¿Porque vas a casa hoy? " Y él le responde: "Me voy a casa para conseguir algunas barras de cortina." Él dijo: "Tú sabes, poner en el apartamento." Frazier solo le dijo "Muy bien" y ya no pensó mas en eso pues estaba ocupado trabajando, esto fue en algún momento entre las 8 y 10 de la mañana. El día del asesinato, Frazier se levanto a las 6:30 a diferencia de Oswald que según Marina, se quedo dormido hasta un poco después de las 7, entre 7 y 7:15 Frazier se encontraba desayunando con su hermana que asegura no hablaron para nada, la mesa de desayuno se encontraba en la cocina y tenia una ventana que daba hacia la calle Westbrook, la madre de Frazier vio a Oswald por la ventana ya que este se asomo por ella y le pregunto que quien era, a lo que el le respondió que era Lee, a diferencia de la hermana de Frazier quien ya lo conocía, Frazier asegura que esta actitud era inusual en Oswald, ya que el nunca iba a su casa si no que era el pasaba a recogerlo, venia a la acera de su casa o lo recogía en la esquina, pero nunca se había asomado hasta la ventana, cuando Frazier dice que Oswald estaba a unos metros de la puerta, entonces caminaron hacia el coche, Frazier tenia la especia de habito de mirar "por encima del hombro" y vio un paquete tirado en el asiento trasero, le pregunto a Oswald que que era y este le respondió "Barras para cortinas" y Frazier dijo "Oh si me habías dicho que ibas a traer unas hoy" y sin tomarle mas importancia se fueron al trabajo. Las especificaciones del paquete por Frazier era que tenia unas 5 o 6 pulgadas de ancho. Cuando llegaron al aparcamiento Oswald bajo primero del coche, ese día no llevaba almuerzo y dijo que lo compraría ahí, Frazier se espero a que cortara el motor para poder cerrar el coche, cuando estaba apenas saliendo del coche Oswald ya habia cerrado la puerta y se estaba adelantando, en vez de caminar junto a el iba mas y mas adelante, esta fue otra actitud inusual de Oswlad ya que en todo el tiempo que llevaban yendo juntos Frazier asegura que siempre caminaban juntos desde el estacionamiento hasta el TSBD, que solo ese día no lo hicieron pues Oswald se adelanto, llevaba una chaqueta y el paquete bajo sus axilas, lo llevaba paralelo a su cuerpo de arriba hacia abajo. Cuando le preguntaron a Frazier si se podía notar que Oswald llevara algo pesado en el paquete, el no pudo asegurarlo, ya que dijo que no le había prestado mucha atención pero si era evidente que llevaba algo, Frazier por lo mismo le creyó que eran cortineros pues el había trabajado antes en una tienda departamental, y ahí había varillas para cortinas sin embalaje cuando vienen directamente de fabrica y podían acomodarse de forma compacta, y como Oswald le dijo que eran las barras de las cortinas a el no se le hizo inusual. Después Frazier dice que vio a Oswald toda la mañana, haciendo su trabajo, (Sí, señor, lo vi de un lado a otro, ya sabe, esa mañana caminando, empastando libros y demás, los pedidos, las facturas tenían órdenes de llenado.) Cabe destacar que Frazier le pregunto a Oswald si el se iría con el como de costumbre a lo que Oswald respondió que no, ya que como habían hablado un día anterior Oswald no iría a casa con el el Viernes por eso había ido el Jueves. Frazier reconoció en la foto de Altgens6 a la persona que se encontraba ahí como Billy Lovelady.
Hay cosas que encierran un misterio en el testimonio de Frazier, las actitudes inusuales de Oswald que había tenido el día del asesinato (Ir hasta su casa y asomarse por la ventana, caminar 50 pies adelante de Frazier del estacionamiento al edificio, no llevar almuerzo) pueden dar a entender que Oswald se encontraba desesperado o con prisa por hacer algo. Pero hay algo todavía mas, Jack Edwin Dougherty, es la única persona que vio a Oswald entrar al edificio, el asegura rotundamente que al momento de entrar Oswald no llevaba nada en las manos, menos algo tan vistoso como seria el paquete.
Testimonio de Dougherty sobre esto
Mr. BALL - The full statement is, "I am employed by the Texas School Book Depository, 411 Elm Street, Dallas, as an order filler, and reside at 1827 South Marsalis Street, Dallas, Tex." Did you tell them that?
Mr. DOUGHERTY - Yes, sir.
Mr. BALL - "I started to work today, 11-22-63, at about 7 a.m. o'clock".
Did you tell them that?
Mr. DOUGHERTY - Yes.
Mr. BALL - The statement says, "I recall vaguely having seen Lee Oswald, when he came to work at about 8 a.m. today."
Mr. DOUGHERTY - That's right.
Mr. BALL - Now, is that a very definite impression that you saw him that morning when he came to work?
Mr. DOUGHERTY - Well, oh--it's like this--I'll try to explain it to you this way--- you see, I was sitting on the wrapping table and when he came in the door, I just caught him out of the corner of my eye---that's the reason why I said it that way.
Mr. BALL - Did he come in with anybody?
Mr. DOUGHERTY - No.
Mr. BALL - He was alone?
Mr. DOUGHERTY - Yes; he was alone.
Mr. BALL - Do you recall him having anything in his hand?
Mr. DOUGHERTY - Well, I didn't see anything, if he did.
Mr. BALL - Did you pay enough attention to him, you think, that you would remember whether he did or didn't?
Mr. DOUGHERTY - Well, I believe I can---yes, sir---I'll put it this way; I didn't see anything in his hands at the time.
Mr. BALL - In other words, your memory is definite on that is it?
Mr. DOUGHERTY - Yes, sir.
Mr. BALL - In other words, you would say positively he had nothing in his hands?
Mr. DOUGHERTY - I would say that---yes, sir.
Mr. BALL - Or, are you guessing?
Mr. DOUGHERTY - I don't think so.
Mr. BALL - You saw him come in the door?
Mr. DOUGHERTY - Yes.
Mr. BALL - The back door on the first floor?
Mr. DOUGHERTY - It was in the back door.
El Sr. BALL - La declaración completa es: "Soy empleado del Texas School Book Depository, 411 Elm Street, Dallas, como ordenador de carga, y resido en el 1827 Sur Marsalis Street, Dallas, Texas" ¿Les dijiste eso?
Sr. DOUGHERTY - Sí, señor.
El Sr. BALL - "Empecé a trabajar hoy, 11/22/63, a las 7 am en punto".
¿Les dijiste eso?
Sr. DOUGHERTY - Sí.
El Sr. BALL - La declaración dice: "Recuerdo vagamente haber visto a Lee Oswald, cuando llegó a trabajar a las 8 am de hoy."
Sr. DOUGHERTY - Eso es.
El Sr. BALL - Ahora, es que una impresión muy clara de que lo viste por la mañana cuando llegó a trabajar?
Sr. DOUGHERTY - Bueno, oh - es como esto - Lo intentaré explicar a usted de esta manera --- ya ve, yo estaba sentado en la mesa de encintado y cuando llegó a la puerta, yo sólo lo miraba por el rabillo de mi ojo --- esa es la razón por la que lo dije de esa manera.
El Sr. BALL - ¿Vino con alguien?
Sr. DOUGHERTY - No.
El Sr. BALL - Estaba solo?
Sr. DOUGHERTY - Sí, estaba solo.
El Sr. BALL - ¿Recuerda usted si tiene algo en la mano?
Sr. DOUGHERTY - Bueno, yo no vi nada, si lo tenia.
El Sr. BALL - ¿Puso usted la suficiente atención a él, que piensa, que usted recuerda si lo hizo o no lo hizo?
Sr. DOUGHERTY - Bueno, creo que puedo --- sí, señor --- lo digo así, yo no veo nada en sus manos en ese momento.
El Sr. BALL - En otras palabras, en su memoria es definitivo que lo es?
Sr. DOUGHERTY - Sí, señor.
El Sr. BALL - En otras palabras, usted diría positivamente que no tenía nada en sus manos?
Sr. DOUGHERTY - Yo diría que --- sí, señor.
El Sr. BALL - O estás adivinando?
Sr. DOUGHERTY - Yo no lo creo.
El Sr. BALL - Usted vio entrar por la puerta?
Sr. DOUGHERTY - Sí.
El Sr. BALL - La puerta de atrás en el primer piso?
Sr. DOUGHERTY - Fue en la puerta de atrás.
Como podemos corroborar se le pregunta a Dougherty si esta adivinando en realidad sobre si Oswald tenia algo o no en las manos, el asegura que no, pues esta completamente seguro. Algo raro sin duda.
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| Frazier reconoció que la persona de esta foto que muchas personas confunden con Oswald es Billy Lovelady |
Aquí les dejo las transcripciones de su testimonio en el informe Warren que utilice para mi resumen.
Sobre su familia.
Mr. BALL - And who lives in that house with you?
Mr. FRAZIER - My sister and brother-in-law and their three children.
Mr. BALL - Will you state their names, your sister's name?
Mr. FRAZIER - Linnie Mae Randle and my brother-in-law. I believe his real name is William Edward Randle. We call him Bill. They have three little girls, Diana, Patricia and Caroline Sue.
Mr. BALL - Where does your mother live?
Mr. FRAZIER - She lives in Huntsville.
Mr. BALL - Where is that?
Mr. FRAZIER - That is about 200 miles south of Dallas there.
Mr. BALL - What is the name of the town?
Mr. FRAZIER - Town, you mean where my mother lives? Huntsville.
Mr. BALL - Huntsville?
Mr. FRAZIER - Yes, sir; that is about, it is about 70, 80 miles north of Houston.
Mr. BALL - What is your mother's name?
Mr. FRAZIER - Essie Mae Williams.
Mr. BALL - Was she visiting you and your sister sometime in November 1963?
Mr. FRAZIER - Yes, sir; she was.
Mr. BALL - How long was she there?
Mr. FRAZIER - She was there for, I believe, for a period of about 4 or 5 weeks because my stepfather was with her and he got sick and they had to put him in the hospital and he was in the hospital 3 or 4 weeks, somewhere, 4 or 5 weeks because they were there a week before he got sick.
Mr. BALL - Then on November 21 and 22, living with you in this residence at Irving, Tex., were your mother, Mrs. Williams, and your sister, Linnie Mae Randle?
Mr. FRAZIER - Right.
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Sobre su Trabajo
Mr. BALL - Where do you work?
Mr. FRAZIER - Work at Texas School Books.
Mr. BALL - How long have you worked there?
Mr. FRAZIER - I have been working there since September.
Mr. BALL - September of 1963?
Mr. FRAZIER - Correct.
Mr. BALL - What kind of work do you do there?
Mr. FRAZIER - I fill orders.
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Sobre como conoció a LHO
Mr. BALL - Did Shelly introduce you to him or did you go up and shake hands with him?
Mr. FRAZIER - No, sir; he didn't. I remember, I knew, you know that he was going to be coming to work so naturally I hadn't been there very long, you know, living in Dallas and so I wanted to make friends with everybody I could, because you know yourself friendship is something you can't buy with money and you always need friends, so I went up and introduced and he told me his name was Lee and I said "We are glad to have you."
We got talking back and forth and he come to find out I knew his wife was staying there at the time with this other woman and so I thought he would go out there and I said, "Are you going to be going home this afternoon?"
And he told me then, he told me that he didn't have a car, you know, and so I told him. I said, "Well, I live out there in Irving,"- I found out he lived out there and so I said, "Any time you want to go just let me know."
So I thought he would go home every day like most men do but he told me no, that he wouldn't go home every day and then he asked me could he ride home say like Friday afternoon on weekends and come back on Monday morning and I told him that would be just fine with me.
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Sobre sus conversaciones con Oswald
Mr. BALL - On the way back and forth did you talk very much to each other?
Mr. FRAZIER - No. sir: not very much. lie is. probably in your line of business you have probably seen a lot of guys who talk a lot and some don't and he was one of these types that just didn't talk. And I have seen, you know, I am not very old but I have seen a lot of guys in my time, just going to school, different boys and girls, some talk a lot and some don't, so I didn't think anything strange about that.
About the only time you could get anything out of the talking was about babies, you know, he had one and he was expecting another, that was one way he had him get that job because his wife was pregnant and I would always get something out of it when I asked him about the babies because it seemed he was very fond of children because when I asked him he chuckled and told me about what he was doing about the babies over the weekend and sometimes we would talk about the weather, and sometimes he would go to work and it would be cloudy in the morning and it would come out that afternoon after work, sometimes during the day and it would turn to be just one of the prettiest days you would want anywhere, and he would say some comment about that, but not very much.
He would say a few words and then he would cut off.
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Conversacion de Frazier con Oswald el jueves 21 de Noviembre
Mr. BALL - Was that the 21st of November?
Mr. FRAZIER - Yes, sir.
Mr. BALL - Well, tell us about that.
Mr. FRAZIER - Well, I say, we were standing like I said at the four-headed table about half as large as this, not, quite half as large, but anyway I was standing there getting the orders in and he said, "Could I ride home with you this afternoon?"
And I said, "Sure. You know, like I told you, you can go home with me any time you want to, like I say anytime you want to go see your wife that is all right with me."
So automatically I knew it wasn't Friday, I come to think it wasn't Friday and I said, "Why are you going home today?"
And he says, "I am going home to get some curtain rods." He said, "You know, put in an apartment."
He wanted to hang up some curtains and I said, "Very well." And I never thought more about it and I had some invoices in my hands for some orders and I walked on off and started filling the orders.
Mr. BALL - This was on what floor?
Mr. FRAZIER - This was on the first floor.
Mr. BALL - About what time in the morning?
Mr. FRAZIER - I would say sometime between eight and ten, because I go to work at eight and I would break at ten.
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Sobre la mañana del asesinato
Mr. FRAZIER - I was sitting there eating my breakfast there, so sitting there, I usually talk to my little nieces, you know, they have them cartoons on for a while and we usually talk a little bit back and forth while eating breakfast and I was just finishing my coffee there and my sister, you know, was working over there around, you know the sink there, and she was fixing my lunch so she was somewhere around there over on the cabinets fixing the cabinets and mother just happened to glance up and saw this man, you know, who was Lee looking in the window for me and she said, "Who is that?"
And I said, "That is Lee," and naturally he just walked around and so I thought he just walked around there on the carport right there close to the door and so I told her I had to go, so I went in there and brushed my teeth right quick and come through there and I usually have my coat laying somewhere on the chair and picked it up and put it on and by that time my sister had my lunch, you know, in a sack and sitting over there on the washer where I picked it up right there by the door and I just walked on out and we got in the car.
Mr. BALL - Now, did your sister say anything as you were having breakfast?
Mr. FRAZIER - No; she didn't say anything to me at all.
Mr. BALL - She didn't say anything to you either about Oswald or did she?
Mr. FRAZIER - No, sir; say, she didn't say, you know, when I looked up and saw him I knew who it was.
Mr. BALL - You saw him?
Mr. FRAZIER - Right.
Mr. BALL - What was he doing?
Mr. FRAZIER - He just looked through the kitchen window. To see from there on the ground outside there. I say you don't have to be any height at all, you don't have to be too tall to be able to look in the kitchen window there.
I say, if you have the window open you can see in, if you have light on in there.
Mr. BALL - When your mother mentioned, "Who is that," you looked up and saw Lee Oswald in the kitchen window?
Mr. FRAZIER - I just saw him for a split second and when he saw I saw him, I guess he heard me say, "Well, it is time to go," and he walked down by the back door there.
Representative FORD - When he would go with you on Monday, on any Monday, was this the same procedure for getting to, getting in contact with you?
Mr. FRAZIER - You mean coming in there and looking through the window?
Representative FORD - Yes.
Mr. FRAZIER - No, sir; it wasn't. I say, that is the first time he had ever done that. I say. most times I would usually call him, you know, I was already out in the car fixing to go out the driveway there, and, you know, around to pick him up if he hadn't come down but most times, once in a while I picked him up at the house and another time he was already coming down the sidewalk to the house when I was fixing to pick him up and I usually picked him up around the corner there.
Representative FORD - Did this different method of him meeting you raise any questions in your mind?
Mr. FRAZIER - No, sir; it didn't. I just thought maybe, you know, he just left a little bit earlier but when I looked up and saw that the clock was. I knew I was the one who was running a little bit late because, as I say, I was talking, sitting there eating breakfast and talking to the little nieces, it was later than I thought it was.
Mr. BALL - When you went out the back door where was Oswald?
Mr. FRAZIER - He was standing just a few feet there outside the back door there.
Mr. BALL - He wasn't in the car?
Mr. FRAZIER - No, sir; he wasn't.
Mr. BALL - Was he near the car?
Mr. FRAZIER - No, sir; he wasn't.
You see, always I keep my car parked outside the carport there, on the other side.
Mr. BALL - He was just a few feet outside your back door when you came out?
Mr. FRAZIER - Right.
Mr. BALL - Did you walk together to the car?
Mr. FRAZIER - Yes; we did.
Mr. BALL - And you got in one side and he got in the other?
Mr. FRAZIER - Yes. Right in front there.
Mr. BALL - Did you say usually you had to go by and pick him up?
Mr. FRAZIER - Well, I said I had a couple of times. Most of the time, you know, he was usually walking down the sidewalk as I was driving out of the driveway so, therefore, I didn't have to go up to the house there to pick him up. I just usually picked him up around the corner because he was usually on the sidewalk and I just stopped and picked him up.
Mr. BALL - Were you later than usual that morning?
Mr. FRAZIER - No, sir; I don't believe we were, because we got to work on time. I say, when I looked at the clock, after I glanced he was there a split second and I just turned around and looked at the clock to see what time it was and it was right amount 7:21 then and I went in and brushed my teeth real quick and running through the house put my coat on and we left.
Mr. BALL - You both got in the car about the same time?
Mr. FRAZIER - Right.
Mr. BALL - All right.
When you got in the car did you say anything to him or did he say anything to you?
Mr. FRAZIER - Let's see, when I got in the car I have a kind of habit of glancing over my shoulder and so at that time I noticed there was a package laying on the back seat, I didn't pay too much attention and I said, "What's the package, Lee?"
And he said, "Curtain rods," and I said, "Oh, yes, you told me you was going to bring some today."
That is the reason, the main reason he was going over there that Thursday afternoon when he was to bring back some curtain rods, so I didn't think any more about it when he told me that.
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Sobre Oswald al llegar al trabajo
Mr. FRAZIER - No, sir.
Mr. BALL - When you got to the parking lot who got out of the car first?
Mr. FRAZIER - He did.
Mr. BALL - You didn't get out immediately then?
Mr. FRAZIER - No, sir; I was sitting there, say, looked at my watch and somewhere around 7 or 8 minutes until and I saw we had a few minutes and I sat there, and as I say you can see the Freeway, Stemmons Freeway, from the warehouse and also the trains coming back and forth and I was sitting there.
What I was doing--glanced up and watching cars for a minute but I was letting my engine run and getting to charge up my battery, because when you stop and start you have to charge up your battery.
Mr. BALL - Did you have your lunch beside you?
Mr. FRAZIER - Yes, sir; I did.
Mr. BALL - Did you notice whether or not Lee had a package that looked like a lunch package that morning?
Mr. FRAZIER - You know like I told you earlier, I say, he didn't take his lunch because I remember right when I got in the car I asked him where was his lunch and he said he was going to buy his lunch that day.
Mr. BALL - He told you that that day, did he?
Mr. FRAZIER - Right. That is right. So, I assumed he was going to buy it, you know, from that catering service man like a lot of the boys do. They don't bring their lunch but they go out and buy their lunch there.
Mr. BALL - What did he do about the package in the back seat when he got out of the car?
Mr. FRAZIER - Like I say, I was watching the gages and watched the car for a few minutes before I cut it off.
Mr. BALL - Yes.
Mr. FRAZIER - He got out of the car and he was wearing the jacket that has the big sleeves in them and he put the package that he had, you know, that he told me was curtain rods up under his arm, you know, and so he walked down behind the car and standing over there at the end of the cyclone fence waiting for me to get out of the car, and so quick as I cut the engine off and started out of the car, shut the door just as I was starting out just like getting out of the car, he started walking off and so I followed him in.
So, eventually there he kept getting a little further ahead of me and I noticed we had plenty of time to get there because it is not too far from the Depository and usually I walk around and watch them switching the trains because you have to watch where you are going if you have to cross the tracks.
One day you go across one track and maybe there would be some cars sitting there and there would be another diesel coming there, so you have to watch when you cross the tracks, I just walked along and I just like to watch them switch the cars, so eventually he kept getting a little further ahead of me and by that time we got down there pretty close to the Depository Building there, I say, he would be as much as, I would say, roughly 50 feet in front of me but I didn't try to catch up with him because I knew I had plenty of time so I just took my time walking up there.
Mr. BALL - Did you usually walk up there together.
Mr. FRAZIER - Yes, sir; we did.
Mr. BALL - Is this the first time that he had ever walked ahead of you?
Mr. FRAZIER - Yes, sir; he did.
Mr. BALL - You say he had the package under his arm when you saw him?
Mr. FRAZIER - Yes, sir.
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Sobre Oswald en su trabajo
Mr. BALL - All right.
Now, this day did you see Lee Oswald the rest of the morning?
Mr. FRAZIER - Yes, sir; I saw him back and forth, you know, that morning walking around, filling books and so forth, filling orders, had invoices filling orders.
Mr. BALL - When you came in that morning to go to work where did you go first?
Mr. FRAZIER - I went like I did every morning, I went down in the basement there and hung up my coat and put up my lunch.
Mr. BALL - Did you see Oswald down there?
Mr. FRAZIER - No; I didn't.
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Mr. FRAZIER - My sister and brother-in-law and their three children.
Mr. BALL - Will you state their names, your sister's name?
Mr. FRAZIER - Linnie Mae Randle and my brother-in-law. I believe his real name is William Edward Randle. We call him Bill. They have three little girls, Diana, Patricia and Caroline Sue.
Mr. BALL - Where does your mother live?
Mr. FRAZIER - She lives in Huntsville.
Mr. BALL - Where is that?
Mr. FRAZIER - That is about 200 miles south of Dallas there.
Mr. BALL - What is the name of the town?
Mr. FRAZIER - Town, you mean where my mother lives? Huntsville.
Mr. BALL - Huntsville?
Mr. FRAZIER - Yes, sir; that is about, it is about 70, 80 miles north of Houston.
Mr. BALL - What is your mother's name?
Mr. FRAZIER - Essie Mae Williams.
Mr. BALL - Was she visiting you and your sister sometime in November 1963?
Mr. FRAZIER - Yes, sir; she was.
Mr. BALL - How long was she there?
Mr. FRAZIER - She was there for, I believe, for a period of about 4 or 5 weeks because my stepfather was with her and he got sick and they had to put him in the hospital and he was in the hospital 3 or 4 weeks, somewhere, 4 or 5 weeks because they were there a week before he got sick.
Mr. BALL - Then on November 21 and 22, living with you in this residence at Irving, Tex., were your mother, Mrs. Williams, and your sister, Linnie Mae Randle?
Mr. FRAZIER - Right.
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Sobre su Trabajo
Mr. BALL - Where do you work?
Mr. FRAZIER - Work at Texas School Books.
Mr. BALL - How long have you worked there?
Mr. FRAZIER - I have been working there since September.
Mr. BALL - September of 1963?
Mr. FRAZIER - Correct.
Mr. BALL - What kind of work do you do there?
Mr. FRAZIER - I fill orders.
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Sobre como conoció a LHO
Mr. BALL - Did Shelly introduce you to him or did you go up and shake hands with him?
Mr. FRAZIER - No, sir; he didn't. I remember, I knew, you know that he was going to be coming to work so naturally I hadn't been there very long, you know, living in Dallas and so I wanted to make friends with everybody I could, because you know yourself friendship is something you can't buy with money and you always need friends, so I went up and introduced and he told me his name was Lee and I said "We are glad to have you."
We got talking back and forth and he come to find out I knew his wife was staying there at the time with this other woman and so I thought he would go out there and I said, "Are you going to be going home this afternoon?"
And he told me then, he told me that he didn't have a car, you know, and so I told him. I said, "Well, I live out there in Irving,"- I found out he lived out there and so I said, "Any time you want to go just let me know."
So I thought he would go home every day like most men do but he told me no, that he wouldn't go home every day and then he asked me could he ride home say like Friday afternoon on weekends and come back on Monday morning and I told him that would be just fine with me.
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Sobre sus conversaciones con Oswald
Mr. BALL - On the way back and forth did you talk very much to each other?
Mr. FRAZIER - No. sir: not very much. lie is. probably in your line of business you have probably seen a lot of guys who talk a lot and some don't and he was one of these types that just didn't talk. And I have seen, you know, I am not very old but I have seen a lot of guys in my time, just going to school, different boys and girls, some talk a lot and some don't, so I didn't think anything strange about that.
About the only time you could get anything out of the talking was about babies, you know, he had one and he was expecting another, that was one way he had him get that job because his wife was pregnant and I would always get something out of it when I asked him about the babies because it seemed he was very fond of children because when I asked him he chuckled and told me about what he was doing about the babies over the weekend and sometimes we would talk about the weather, and sometimes he would go to work and it would be cloudy in the morning and it would come out that afternoon after work, sometimes during the day and it would turn to be just one of the prettiest days you would want anywhere, and he would say some comment about that, but not very much.
He would say a few words and then he would cut off.
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Conversacion de Frazier con Oswald el jueves 21 de Noviembre
Mr. BALL - Was that the 21st of November?
Mr. FRAZIER - Yes, sir.
Mr. BALL - Well, tell us about that.
Mr. FRAZIER - Well, I say, we were standing like I said at the four-headed table about half as large as this, not, quite half as large, but anyway I was standing there getting the orders in and he said, "Could I ride home with you this afternoon?"
And I said, "Sure. You know, like I told you, you can go home with me any time you want to, like I say anytime you want to go see your wife that is all right with me."
So automatically I knew it wasn't Friday, I come to think it wasn't Friday and I said, "Why are you going home today?"
And he says, "I am going home to get some curtain rods." He said, "You know, put in an apartment."
He wanted to hang up some curtains and I said, "Very well." And I never thought more about it and I had some invoices in my hands for some orders and I walked on off and started filling the orders.
Mr. BALL - This was on what floor?
Mr. FRAZIER - This was on the first floor.
Mr. BALL - About what time in the morning?
Mr. FRAZIER - I would say sometime between eight and ten, because I go to work at eight and I would break at ten.
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Sobre la mañana del asesinato
Mr. FRAZIER - I was sitting there eating my breakfast there, so sitting there, I usually talk to my little nieces, you know, they have them cartoons on for a while and we usually talk a little bit back and forth while eating breakfast and I was just finishing my coffee there and my sister, you know, was working over there around, you know the sink there, and she was fixing my lunch so she was somewhere around there over on the cabinets fixing the cabinets and mother just happened to glance up and saw this man, you know, who was Lee looking in the window for me and she said, "Who is that?"
And I said, "That is Lee," and naturally he just walked around and so I thought he just walked around there on the carport right there close to the door and so I told her I had to go, so I went in there and brushed my teeth right quick and come through there and I usually have my coat laying somewhere on the chair and picked it up and put it on and by that time my sister had my lunch, you know, in a sack and sitting over there on the washer where I picked it up right there by the door and I just walked on out and we got in the car.
Mr. BALL - Now, did your sister say anything as you were having breakfast?
Mr. FRAZIER - No; she didn't say anything to me at all.
Mr. BALL - She didn't say anything to you either about Oswald or did she?
Mr. FRAZIER - No, sir; say, she didn't say, you know, when I looked up and saw him I knew who it was.
Mr. BALL - You saw him?
Mr. FRAZIER - Right.
Mr. BALL - What was he doing?
Mr. FRAZIER - He just looked through the kitchen window. To see from there on the ground outside there. I say you don't have to be any height at all, you don't have to be too tall to be able to look in the kitchen window there.
I say, if you have the window open you can see in, if you have light on in there.
Mr. BALL - When your mother mentioned, "Who is that," you looked up and saw Lee Oswald in the kitchen window?
Mr. FRAZIER - I just saw him for a split second and when he saw I saw him, I guess he heard me say, "Well, it is time to go," and he walked down by the back door there.
Representative FORD - When he would go with you on Monday, on any Monday, was this the same procedure for getting to, getting in contact with you?
Mr. FRAZIER - You mean coming in there and looking through the window?
Representative FORD - Yes.
Mr. FRAZIER - No, sir; it wasn't. I say, that is the first time he had ever done that. I say. most times I would usually call him, you know, I was already out in the car fixing to go out the driveway there, and, you know, around to pick him up if he hadn't come down but most times, once in a while I picked him up at the house and another time he was already coming down the sidewalk to the house when I was fixing to pick him up and I usually picked him up around the corner there.
Representative FORD - Did this different method of him meeting you raise any questions in your mind?
Mr. FRAZIER - No, sir; it didn't. I just thought maybe, you know, he just left a little bit earlier but when I looked up and saw that the clock was. I knew I was the one who was running a little bit late because, as I say, I was talking, sitting there eating breakfast and talking to the little nieces, it was later than I thought it was.
Mr. BALL - When you went out the back door where was Oswald?
Mr. FRAZIER - He was standing just a few feet there outside the back door there.
Mr. BALL - He wasn't in the car?
Mr. FRAZIER - No, sir; he wasn't.
Mr. BALL - Was he near the car?
Mr. FRAZIER - No, sir; he wasn't.
You see, always I keep my car parked outside the carport there, on the other side.
Mr. BALL - He was just a few feet outside your back door when you came out?
Mr. FRAZIER - Right.
Mr. BALL - Did you walk together to the car?
Mr. FRAZIER - Yes; we did.
Mr. BALL - And you got in one side and he got in the other?
Mr. FRAZIER - Yes. Right in front there.
Mr. BALL - Did you say usually you had to go by and pick him up?
Mr. FRAZIER - Well, I said I had a couple of times. Most of the time, you know, he was usually walking down the sidewalk as I was driving out of the driveway so, therefore, I didn't have to go up to the house there to pick him up. I just usually picked him up around the corner because he was usually on the sidewalk and I just stopped and picked him up.
Mr. BALL - Were you later than usual that morning?
Mr. FRAZIER - No, sir; I don't believe we were, because we got to work on time. I say, when I looked at the clock, after I glanced he was there a split second and I just turned around and looked at the clock to see what time it was and it was right amount 7:21 then and I went in and brushed my teeth real quick and running through the house put my coat on and we left.
Mr. BALL - You both got in the car about the same time?
Mr. FRAZIER - Right.
Mr. BALL - All right.
When you got in the car did you say anything to him or did he say anything to you?
Mr. FRAZIER - Let's see, when I got in the car I have a kind of habit of glancing over my shoulder and so at that time I noticed there was a package laying on the back seat, I didn't pay too much attention and I said, "What's the package, Lee?"
And he said, "Curtain rods," and I said, "Oh, yes, you told me you was going to bring some today."
That is the reason, the main reason he was going over there that Thursday afternoon when he was to bring back some curtain rods, so I didn't think any more about it when he told me that.
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Sobre Oswald al llegar al trabajo
Mr. FRAZIER - No, sir.
Mr. BALL - When you got to the parking lot who got out of the car first?
Mr. FRAZIER - He did.
Mr. BALL - You didn't get out immediately then?
Mr. FRAZIER - No, sir; I was sitting there, say, looked at my watch and somewhere around 7 or 8 minutes until and I saw we had a few minutes and I sat there, and as I say you can see the Freeway, Stemmons Freeway, from the warehouse and also the trains coming back and forth and I was sitting there.
What I was doing--glanced up and watching cars for a minute but I was letting my engine run and getting to charge up my battery, because when you stop and start you have to charge up your battery.
Mr. BALL - Did you have your lunch beside you?
Mr. FRAZIER - Yes, sir; I did.
Mr. BALL - Did you notice whether or not Lee had a package that looked like a lunch package that morning?
Mr. FRAZIER - You know like I told you earlier, I say, he didn't take his lunch because I remember right when I got in the car I asked him where was his lunch and he said he was going to buy his lunch that day.
Mr. BALL - He told you that that day, did he?
Mr. FRAZIER - Right. That is right. So, I assumed he was going to buy it, you know, from that catering service man like a lot of the boys do. They don't bring their lunch but they go out and buy their lunch there.
Mr. BALL - What did he do about the package in the back seat when he got out of the car?
Mr. FRAZIER - Like I say, I was watching the gages and watched the car for a few minutes before I cut it off.
Mr. BALL - Yes.
Mr. FRAZIER - He got out of the car and he was wearing the jacket that has the big sleeves in them and he put the package that he had, you know, that he told me was curtain rods up under his arm, you know, and so he walked down behind the car and standing over there at the end of the cyclone fence waiting for me to get out of the car, and so quick as I cut the engine off and started out of the car, shut the door just as I was starting out just like getting out of the car, he started walking off and so I followed him in.
So, eventually there he kept getting a little further ahead of me and I noticed we had plenty of time to get there because it is not too far from the Depository and usually I walk around and watch them switching the trains because you have to watch where you are going if you have to cross the tracks.
One day you go across one track and maybe there would be some cars sitting there and there would be another diesel coming there, so you have to watch when you cross the tracks, I just walked along and I just like to watch them switch the cars, so eventually he kept getting a little further ahead of me and by that time we got down there pretty close to the Depository Building there, I say, he would be as much as, I would say, roughly 50 feet in front of me but I didn't try to catch up with him because I knew I had plenty of time so I just took my time walking up there.
Mr. BALL - Did you usually walk up there together.
Mr. FRAZIER - Yes, sir; we did.
Mr. BALL - Is this the first time that he had ever walked ahead of you?
Mr. FRAZIER - Yes, sir; he did.
Mr. BALL - You say he had the package under his arm when you saw him?
Mr. FRAZIER - Yes, sir.
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Sobre Oswald en su trabajo
Mr. BALL - All right.
Now, this day did you see Lee Oswald the rest of the morning?
Mr. FRAZIER - Yes, sir; I saw him back and forth, you know, that morning walking around, filling books and so forth, filling orders, had invoices filling orders.
Mr. BALL - When you came in that morning to go to work where did you go first?
Mr. FRAZIER - I went like I did every morning, I went down in the basement there and hung up my coat and put up my lunch.
Mr. BALL - Did you see Oswald down there?
Mr. FRAZIER - No; I didn't.
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